Choosing Between Two Jobs

This is one of those times where you need to go talk to your manager.

You need to tell him: I dont want you to intercede in this matter, I want to develop the skills to deal with this myself.

You need to say out loud. "stop speaking over me", "stop cutting so and so of", "xxx be quite YYY was not done speaking, YYY continue". You need to take ownership over your ideas and speak up for yourself.

The ladder up in business is a human one, you can be a rung or you can learn to climb. You dont have to be a dick about things but you should NOT be walked on with out deference or credit.

EDIT and PS: Never take a pay cut unless you're unemployed. That line only goes UP.

Sounds like you’re looking for a company where you make meaningful contributions to the code and push yourself. In that case, look for positions at smaller companies. Figure out how much of a paycut you’re willing to endure, because you’ll probably end up working overtime with no additional pay anyway.

My biggest suggestion though would be to find a way to cope with what you have. You got annoying coworkers that try to be managers and go into too much detail at standups? Guess what bud, that’s never gonna go away. Part of your career growth is how you deal with things when your work situation is very mediocre or at worst, very toxic. That means having to make tough decisions and weathering storms gracefully. Take your time, and never let your ego or emotions influence your decision.

It sounds like you don't have an amazing manager, you have an easy manager - a comfortable manager. Someone who is pleasant to work with, but who is not effective at their job of managing the team.

Or, it could be that they are not amazing at managing you. They are not helping you find solutions to the problems you are having, nor are they mentoring you to resolve the problems yourself. As a result you are diminishing your own presence and work. And they are ok with that?

To answer your question, I would not switch. It sounds like you mostly like the job, you just dislike a couple co-workers. That will always be the case, anywhere you go. Part of learning to navigate your career is learning how to work with people whose working and communication styles differ from your own.

It sounds like you're in a challenging situation at work. Dealing with difficult coworkers who dominate conversations, dismiss ideas, and take credit for others' contributions can be very frustrating and demoralizing. It's understandable that this dynamic is making you consider changing jobs. Only you can decide if the trade-offs of the new job are worth it. But a 15% pay cut is significant, and more hours can come at the cost of work-life balance and fulfillment. And as you note, there's no guarantee the culture will be better. Good luck!

My recommendation is simply know what you want. If you don’t give a shit about people then just follow the money. If you care about people then be very choosy about extremely solid leadership. If you care about quality of product then only choose jobs where you actually build things and learn.

In any scenario I personally would choose a great team to work with and opportunities to learn and build cool things over everything else.

> ...devil you know is better...

Yes. Losing 15% of your income to jump into an even more unpleasant environment would suck.

Your current job doesn't sound all that bad. Wait for a 10% bump before switching.

If you’re okay with sticking it out in your current position, why not keep interviewing and hold out for a role you’re excited about?

These types of problems you usually bring forth in retros. Have you done that, what was the outcome?

You might just be burnt out.

Maybe take a few months off?

> the other team members are the complete opposite and terrific to work alongside.

good!

> the defacto leader of our group/team (he has no actual managerial title or responsibilities) belittles or speaks over people all the time

> any ideas i have are either dismissed outright or pawned off later as someone else's.

not good.

as sibling comments have alluded to, you need to fix this issue in place. unless it's the real manager you have a hopeless beef with, it's not time to quit. oh, and i'd expect apathy or a weak response at first. that's pretty normal. welcome to life. /s the best strategy is to be right. is this guy your actual manager or not? (not) who was the decision responsibility/authority? (not technically him, right?) and so on. you tell the real manager all of this and that you would like to not have technical decisions dictated always from a peer. you would like an area to work that you have some modest authority over.

so you need to be assertive. if you don't, you'll just make 15% less and still have the same team member issue somewhere else with a different name.