HACKER Q&A
📣 bendigedig

Is being a software engineer worth it?


I live in the UK and would love some career advice. My career to date:

- I went from subsidised housing to oxbridge to do a scientific degree. I felt completely out of place there, almost dropped out due to mental health problems, returned to redo a year, and then suffered through to the end of the degree. - After I graduated, I moved to a place in the north of England to work for a company that creates medical software. This looked like a promising opportunity to me but ended up being a completely toxic working culture; more like a personality cult than a company. - I then moved to London (where the jobs are) and got a job in the City of London. I had to be pretty independent since there were no real seniors to learn from. After about 4 years, I got to the point where I didn't see any real growth within the job and I had some issues with cultural differences. - So I went to a mid-range university in a pretty rural area and did a Data Science Masters degree. I generally enjoyed my time there. - I joined a start-up in Dublin - I thought I might enjoy the environment since they used F# - I mistakenly believed that a place like that might be open to hearing different ideas; maybe I could make a difference? I ended up feeling like I was powerless to influence anything there, and left when I started being bullied by my line manager. - I played around trying to build my own small start up at the start of the pandemic; I got a little bit of funding to do this, but ended up having to bail out before I could develop the real MVP, or convince any businesses to buy my product. - So during covid, I joined the civil service to work on a project I believed in; I took a substantial pay cut compared to previous private sector salaries, but I thought it might be worth it if I ended up doing something that felt worthwhile. I found myself in the paradoxical position of my suggestions have often fallen on deaf ears, but colleagues oddly coming to exactly the same conclusions 6 months down the road after they've done a bit of research themselves.

I've handed my notice in on this job because we find it virtually impossible to recruit senior developers (a combination of frustrating bureaucracy and unrealistically low wages); this means I'm expected to plan and execute all of our plans, as well as teaching a team of 5 recent graduates how to do a half-decent job of software engineering. I'm feeling completely worn-out by the bureaucracy and my inability to influence anything.

Maybe this wouldn't be such a problem if I could achieve something in other areas of my life, but inflation in the UK has eaten over 20% of my income over the past couple of years, and house prices in the area I live have increased 41% since 2020. What am I working for?

My question is this:

Is this what work-life is typically like for everyone else? Moving from employer to employer, having such limited influence?

And if it doesn't have to be like this then how can I end the cycle of landing jobs that don't work for me? How can I put my skills to use in an environment where I feel like I have agency and am working on something worthwhile?

But mostly I'm feeling like I've been sold a lie, and I'm wondering what the point of continuing to be a software engineer is.

And before anyone suggests therapy: 9 years and counting.

TLDR: I'm fed up of working rubbish jobs where I don't feel like I'm not doing something worthwhile, or end up being worked like a dog. Have I just had bad experiences? Should I keep doing the same thing hoping for a different result?

Throwaway for obvious reasons.


  👤 surprisetalk Accepted Answer ✓
Hey, so sorry to hear about your kafkaesque situation. It doesn't seem like it right now, but you're going to make it through this. You seem diligent enough to forge a better destiny :)

> Is this what work-life is typically like for everyone else? Moving from employer to employer, having such limited influence?

I've found that my influence is inversely proportional to the number of people in the company. The tradeoff is that influence usually demands higher stress and longer working hours. I'm now running a company of size 1 for maximum stress and working hours :)

> And if it doesn't have to be like this then how can I end the cycle of landing jobs that don't work for me? How can I put my skills to use in an environment where I feel like I have agency and am working on something worthwhile?

For career pathing, I highly recommend reading So Good They Can't Ignore You. Email me at hello@taylor.town and I'll mail you a copy for free.

Autonomy is a huge part of job satisfaction, and autonomy is generally best achieved through skills and strategic lateral moves.

My guess is that you should figure out what life you want to live, and work backwards on how to get there fastest with your current skillset.

Thanks for sharing and being vulnerable! Taking the time to discover happiness is an underrated trait :)


👤 gregjor
I hate to break it to you but most jobs lead to the kinds of experiences you describe. Those experiences can feel more or less soul-crushing depending on your expectations and how you react to them. I get the impression that you expect personal fulfillment, respect, influence from your work, and when you don't get that you feel frustrated.

So, yes, this is what work-life is like for everyone else. If you think programming for a living is bad imagine working at a restaurant or retailer with the same bullshit but a fraction of the pay.

I suggest you disconnect your ego from your job and enjoy the relatively cushy work and pay. Find fulfillment somewhere else. I burned out twice earlier in my career (40+ years and still going at this point), then I had children, something more important to me than any job or jerk boss or boring project.

You should also consider what all of your job frustrations have in common: you. No one can control what other people do, or how organizations roll along with dysfunction and lack of real purpose. But we can all control how we internalize and react.


👤 d00d1toldme2p
I can see why you're feeling burnt out and disillusioned with the software engineering career path. I've been in the industry for over 20 years, and there have definitely been times when I've questioned whether it's worth it or not.

Inflation, the advent of AI, ever-changing technology, and wealth disparity are all factors that contribute to a sense of disillusionment and frustration. The inflation in the UK you mentioned is a significant issue, and it's a struggle many of us are facing. The rapid development of AI and technology also means we constantly need to keep learning and updating our skills, which can be exhausting. The wealth disparity is another factor that makes it hard to feel like we're making progress, as the rich keep getting richer, and the rest of us seem to be stuck in a rut.

Your experiences are not uncommon, but that doesn't mean they're universal. It's true that many people in our field bounce from one job to another, dealing with the same challenges and bureaucracy. However, there are also those who have found their niche, where they feel valued and are making a meaningful contribution.

Unfortunately, I can't offer a magic solution to break the cycle of landing jobs that don't work for you. What I can suggest, though, is to prioritize finding a company culture that aligns with your values and where you believe you'll have a voice. It may require networking, researching, and perhaps even taking a temporary pay cut or a lower position to gain entry, but it could be worth it in the long run.

That being said, I don't want to sugarcoat things. The reality is that the software engineering field can be quite taxing, and sometimes it may feel like there's no light at the end of the tunnel. You've been in therapy for nine years, so I won't suggest that again, but it might be worth considering whether you want to continue in this field or explore other options that might bring you more satisfaction and a sense of purpose.


👤 bloqs
I wish I had net someone like you in the workplace.

You seem principally frustrated by social components- being taken seriously. Respect from people is a function of social hierachical perception (not job title or rank but they help).

My own experience in the UK is that we are a culture of aesthetics over ideas in the workplace: how things and how you appear is vastly more important than the underlying competencies. Ricky Jervais in the office is still accurate to this day.

You are clearly technically proficient and intelligent, but you may need to develop your soft skills and awareness to win people over more.

Or just tell them to get to fuck and find something else


👤 gniv
I got lucky early on with my job. It was great, mostly because I liked the people I worked with. So I cannot relate to your experience. But in terms of trying to influence things (like effect major change), I never really tried to do that. I knew that my personality was not suited for it. I've seen people who tried and failed and I agree it can be discouraging. If I get another job I would look mainly at the people I would be working with and the general culture. The project, the stack, the mission, none of that is as important to me, a middle-aged swe.

👤 borplk
I'm wondering how much of this is specifically about software engineering vs other similar "worker bee #57" office jobs?

I think broadly speaking it's mostly the same thing in most places. You might get lucky here and there in your career with an exceptionally good company but that tends to be the exception rather than the norm.

If you can make it as an independent person working on your own stuff that will give you more satisfaction but obviously it's not for everyone.


👤 beardyw
It seems your primary frustration is not having your ideas taken seriously. In my experience that requires either being in a senior position, or being "the person who knows about these things". Neither of those is about having great ideas, though it helps.

👤 throwawaysalome
No one cares.