Should I quit my job?

This sounds like AWS, but probably resembles most large companies. Hire great people down a level, and suddenly you are raising the bar. However, you are also grouping folks with 10+ years doing great work with folks who just got promo'd on their first job out of college.

I have not quit. Instead I became a high achiever in other aspects of life. I listen to folks at work talking about programming podcasts and online tech conferences..... I won a bike race last year and podium'd in a 100 mile off road race. I can cook pretty quickly these days, which results in making healthy, tasty food that my kids actually eat (along with the kraft mac n cheese which is an anchor nobody can escape).

Anyway, once you step away from computers life is huge. Give your job what it needs, and give the rest to yourself.

Don’t just quit your job without another lined up. Milk the current company for everything you can while finding a new job. They’ll find a way to offer you the position and pay you deserved from the beginning when you put in your 2 weeks. Don’t accept their crap, find a better job, and move on. I do think you’d regret quitting without anything lined up. I’d just twiddle my fingers and do as little as possible at current company.

Before reading: If you're at the point of asking, the answer is probably yes. This isn't true of all professions, but for software development it usually is.

After reading: HELL YES. Get the hell out of there (but don't just quit without finding another job first, I mean just start interviewing as soon as you can). "The processes won't allow it" is corp-speak for 'don't expect anything ever from this company'. I've worked at levels above me (did the job of my boss after he quit) and never got a promotion for it, despite being told I should get one if I just hang on, for three years. The way to get to your level is to leave that company and join a new one at the level where you're supposed to be.

The hurdles to getting a new job suck, but you have to do it for your own sanity. Start doing whatever you need to prepare for it now, and make it a priority, even over your job if need be.

Happened to me at AWS.

And worse, several clearly less talented folks on my team are getting promoted to senior before me (due to tenure/politicking). I virtually took the day off every time it happened.

And worse, my boss promised me promotion in an upcoming cycle once (after 1y), and it didn't come. It's promised to me again (after 2y). Should happen any day now.. can't help but feel it was held hostage to deliver a 6-8mo effort.

The only true leverage I have is to come to my boss with another job offer. And I tried, but couldn't find anything that I was willing to be called my bluff on. Job market is scary. In the US you are competing against 30k-50k layoffs (who are in the top 10% at least).

You are really angry right now, and perhaps rightfully so. Just don't make an objectively bad decision by quitting a job in a recession without another/better one.

Take 2 weeks off. Reduce your work hours/responsibility (if you're not senior, don't work like a Senior). Consider blocking off 2-3h/day for either interview prep, OR indie dev. Write a list of the things you appreciate about your current job and practice gratitude consciously.

Companies are always finding ways to justify lacks of pay rise. The company I was working for got acquired by a much bigger company with all these complex procedures in place and they intentionally allocated all the acquired employees much lower "career levels" so that they can justify no pay rises by pointing out that we're over-paid for our level. I've got 25-years of experience but am on the same level as new graduate hires. They also know that because I'm a foreigner and do have a family to worry about that I'm not going anywhere in a hurry. The industry is also quite badly ageist. Trying to even get a new job once in your mid-40s can be a challenge.

well there is no need to immediately resign

the employers behaviour here is offensive to any persons sensibilities and I think everyone reading this would be of the same mind to moving on as soon as possible. The way to do this is of course start talking with other employers, there is no reason why you couldn't rustle up some more suitable opportunities whilst you continue in post with this employer. Go only when you have found the right opportunity

Don’t quit, start searching for better jobs.

Don’t go indie, it will burn your savings - scratch this itch later when you’re better motivated.

Don’t get disillusioned with the industry, bad jobs are more common than good jobs, move on until you find one that appreciates you better.

Sure it’s easier to stay with the familiar prison than face the possibility of the unknown, but the bravery of stepping out is the cost that must be paid for the search for happiness, the easy decision is usually not the correct one.

Start applying!

Title doesn’t matter. Pay does.

Also titles are not the same across companies. SR dev at one place is a level 5 dev at another is a lead dev at a third.

If you are at the pay you want with a lower title, that is pure gold. It means an easy promotion, which is a pay bump.

Fighting for a higher title as an IC when happy with the pay seems like you are fighting against yourself. You want to be hired at the highest possible title so you have many years to go until a promotion?

Companies hiring you at a lower lever and then making it very difficult to you to level up due to "processes" are a dime a dozen. Start by doing the bare minimum at your current job, including taking long(er) breaks during the days if you happen to work from home.

I'm surprised that you say that you have 10 years of professional experience if you were actually having this conversation with a company.

Get another job.

The interviews are part of the process. This is tough love: Suck it up. There's a part of you that does have the energy, and you know that. The fact that you can get excited as an indie dev says that you're not as burned out as you might think. You're just scared. It makes sense. But you can do it.

I hope this helps.

Especially if you're working remotely, start looking for other positions.

Upgrade your LinkedIn to premium and set it so that only recruiters see you're open for work. With 10+ years of experience you'll have recruiters crawling in your inbox like cockroaches :D

Only quit when you've already signed a contract with the new employer, just be mindful of any notice periods you may have.

Sounds like you burned out for a slow-moving enterprise that likely expects regular employee turnover. Also with 10 years of experience and still not having senior title is definitely not a great deal either. The goal-posts for developer titles have moved for some time now (junior, standard, senior, tech-lead/staff, senior staff, etc. etc.) and some have gotten senior title by just having few years of experience. Cultural variance across tech / IT companies are still pretty wild.

You should look for medium or small companies that doesn't have a lot of bureaucratic management layers if you want more direct feedback on the effort you put in. In my experience, success in large enterprises was usually helping your manager sell your project to rest of the company.

Anyways, you definitely should be looking for new opportunities while also cutting back on the amount of effort you put in your current company. General markets might be burning but demand for IT is still forever growing.

Why do you want a senior position? More money? More responsibility? In other words, what do you really want?

Would you be happy with a promotion that came with a meaningless raise? A promotion that had you doing the same thing?

In my experience, titles are absolutely meaningless outside of larger tech companies that have leveling guidelines.

Does your company have a leveling guideline?

I was in a similar situation a year and a half ago. I quit my job with nothing else lined up, despite advice to the contrary, and found a new one in a few months.

It worked out well for me, and I'd probably do it again without much hesitation if it felt necessary.

That's probably not enough to decide if it's worth it for you, but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents.

I feel burned out from my job all of the time. Believe it or not, the best way for me to zone work out is to work.. on my own stuff.

If you feel like you're stuck at worth, it's pretty therapeutic to feel productive on things outside of work. For me, that's been side projects, my blog, ice hockey, running, and my family.

There was a point in my life where I really seriously considered quitting everything and just traveling southeast asia for a while. But there's this saying, "wherever you go, there you are". A lot of the issues in my case where actually intrinsic and not related to my environment. I did travel around a bit, but it was actually just super lonely and isolating. All of these cool things to see, nobody to share the view with.

Ultimately it's better to just work with what you've got and set up roots, start growing them. If your job root isn't growing, that's fine, work on the other ones.

Search for another job offer in a place you fancy, then talk to your manager about it.

Either you're valued and suddenly the procedures won't be an issue, or you have found yourself another place to work.

But take your time, no rush. Just make sure you keep showing your value in your current job, that's your only currency.

Do you have significant equity vesting? That would be the only reason I would hang on/coast in the current role.

It sounds like this is stressing you out big time and you're very burnt out. How many months of runway do you have if you quit today? I would anticipate 4-6 months of unemployment but it sounds like you're not in North America so it might be different where you are.

Basically my advice is quit immediately, live off savings for at least 3 months and don't think about applying for jobs. Don't even code if you're not enjoying it. Do something else, feel like you're mastering some hobby, and after 3 months start looking for jobs. You'll find you have a lot more mental capacity to deal with interview bullshit and hopefully in the next role you won't burn out as quickly.

You are resentful because you feel like you got lied to and are continuously being taken advantage of -- and there's nothing anyone can do because of inhuman "processes". You could radically adjust your attitude so you don't feel that way and have gratitude that you're not working in a coal mine, or start interviewing -- probably you should do both, adjust your attitude so your life is less miserable, and start interviewing. But why dwell on senior vs junior, isn't the relevant unit of account $$/year?

If Sunday morning all you can think about is how horrible Monday will be, and it gives you loads of anxiety, then you are burning out and you prolly need to quit -- you'll figure something out.

If you've already decided to move on (based on the comments here), you can go in with a last ditch effort; show them you were hired as senior, show your glowing reviews, and demand a promotion and/or raise.

If they refuse, that's cool, you give them your resignation - they probably anticipate a resignation already.

If they try to meet you partway, that's cool too, but it's basically them making up for something they should have done when they hired you.

If they agree to your demands, that's an excellent result. That gives you a starting salary to negotiate with if you then decide to move on anyway, but any immediate financial pressure should be off your shoulders then.

> I have some ideas I want to try out and it’s one thing I could get excited about in tech.

Do the minimal amount of what you need to do at work to get your job done and work on a side hustle that gets you excited at night. Limit it to 2 or 3 hours per day but stay consistent. At the same time study the job market and identify opportunities that would work for you then learn the technologies and skills required for those positions and add that as skills on your resume.

Life is too short to not be excited about what you are doing every morning you wake up. But you also have to have an action plan for the future to get out of the status quo.

Before quitting, can you find ways of operating in your current role that bespeak senior level ability? Like introducing a new framework, or doing a bigger than expected refactor that helps other departments as part of your regular work? Can you propose something to a project manager that opens up new horizons? Start over-achieving well beyond the expectations, and see if that finally gets you the recognition you want. You don't need a formal title to get the respect and permission to act that a senior dev has. Look up primus inter pares - it's a great position to occupy in an org.

>I found out about this only 6 months in.

The fact that you realised what had happened 6 months after signing the contract might give you some information about how motivated you were about this job in the first place.

Of course, this is just me guessing but it looks like you've been delaying an important decision about what you want and can do about your career. In fact, your message contains some hints about what the issue is.

Finally, not a piece of advice though, but whatever you decide, try to do it as a positive step not as a direct reaction to what happened with your current employer.

Quit with a plan. I know the classic knee-jerk advice is to have a job in waiting first, but that may not apply to you. A well-crafted sabbatical can give you a sense of energy, motivation, and purpose.

You might be able to do it from abroad on the cheap. There are plenty of resources that can help you structure your thought and time. Just realize being single and financially secure is an opportunity to explore and discover. These moments in life where you have the freedom and interest to work on yourself aren't all that many. Good luck.

Is the job remote? If so, then if you get paid as a mid-level dev, you should perform as a good mid-level dev. Nothing more than that. Do the absolute minimum required to remain on the standard promotion path (i.e. the 1.5-2 years you said).

Try to arrange your meetings to keep your Friday free. Use your new-found free time to search for new jobs, or even bootstrap your own project.

I'm a software developer with 20+ years of experience. I've been working at my current company for at least a few years. I recently found out that some of my colleagues that have been here for less time than I have, who have less experience than I do, got promoted ahead of me. Like you I also get good reviews during review time.

I feel like I should be upset about this. After all, I do value recognition, and would like to see my work validated among my peers. However it would seem that skill and effort are not required to be promoted at my current company. And from experience this is a general truth: there will always be biases, social structures, etc to overcome.

I am not entirely upset by it. I am already paid a lot of money and I'm not left wanting in life. I have few responsibilities at work which is great because I have lot at home (unlike you I do have dependents, a spouse, a mortgage, etc). A promotion would mean more responsibility and pressure along with the higher pay. And that's not going to make the work any more interesting or challenging in the ways I find satisfying.

What would improve my life is having interesting work to do. Most of what I work on is extremely boring enterprise business-ware. I've given up being ambitious and working on interesting, challenging work because I'm more concerned and interested in my family and our well-being and my hobbies than I am in trying to change the world or prove anything.

If, one day, this company does manage to exit and my options turn out to be valuable and I make a bunch of F-U money then it won't matter anyway. That's when I can loosen the collar and sit back and do my own thing.

So my advice is: don't evaluate your life based on your job and its social hierarchies. Promotions, titles, etc are almost always bullshit in tech. Instead look at what you have and try to think about what it is that you need, what expectations are being missed and make a move that will improve the quality of your life.

If you have enough money to survive for six months with a tight budget maybe you're in the right place to start your own company?

Maybe you can take time off to dedicate time to a side project you find fulfilling?

On the flip side, maybe starting a new hobby is the way to go and just clock in/out at work. Chasing promotions is hard work and perhaps the benefits are not that valuable to you.

Try to sign up for a real vacation asap

Two weeks out 6 weeks whatever you can swing

Take it

Relax

Interview if you feel like it

You're in a bad spot

Def do not quit if you are not dying

Hiring companies love to torture the jobless

Whereas they know they only have very limited runway w a jobbed applicant

Look for a 4 day work week

Consider contracting for a quick hire

Know the hiring process before you spend any real time else you could really screw yourself like spend 20 hours then bail

An alternative. Reduce the amount of work you do. Let deadlines slip. Don't go that extra mile. Just reduce your output to the level you feel is appropriate for your job level. If inflation is 10% and no pay raise then you should be doing 10% less work per week. Take half a day to yourself, every week.

"if you have to ask then it's probably time to go"

don't jump until you have something lined up. lot of layoffs happening now and the market is is reasonably saturated, plus finding a job often takes longer than you think.

try to network in person a bunch. linux user groups, python hackers collectives, etc.

Their processes allow it. They simple have a process of saying, "processes don't allow it" until you notify them that they'll need to get the necessary waivers up the chain of command or you'll be working elsewhere shortly.

> TL;DR I am probably burned out, looking for validation from anonymous people online to make a serious life decision, what could possibly go wrong.

This is it, on top of it being a crappy company.

Don't worry. Most of us that have been around long enough have been there. Just dig the ditches while trying to find a new job. While the job market is tighter, there are still plenty of senior level jobs out there. From the conversations that I've had with recruiters, there's really a glut of juniors, while there's a lot of space for seniors.

Don't stay and "work your way into a senior". That's a bait ands switch as old as time. They're trying to get senior level talent at mid level cost. Do the work of an average mid level if you're paid as a mid level.

In the mean while (while looking for other positions), find something that mentally stimulates you.

In your employment contract - it should have your job title / level.

I'd find another job and - if you were lied to, I'd talk to a lawyer.

i bet the processes will allow it if they really see the risk of losing you. If even then they don't care --> leave as fast as you can. Company is not your friend and usually not interested in "wasting" money on giving you more salary then they have to.

at least my 2 cents

Never quit a job without something lined up. One of the first things your interviewer will ask is "What happened at the last job?"

It's a bad time to quit and honestly, the stress and financial impact of unemployment is far worse than working an annoying yet lucrative job.

I've said this in many similar threads but programmers/SWE are among the most privileged workers in the world economy and the grass is NOT greener on the other side. SWEs make enough money they can retire in half the time as the average worker if they so desire, so I'd stick it out and focus on other things in life outside of work for fulfillment.

If you quit today, expect this to be your last technical position. You will not find another job this year.

I know incredible engineers with great experience, well known engineers, who have been unemployed 50% of the time or more during Covid.

It's no longer a seller's market, it's a buyer's market. If you do find a new job, it will take you a long time, and you will take a lower salary than you have now.