HACKER Q&A
📣 poordadrichson

How to best take advantage of the coming recession?


I'm 32 years old and living in Europe and come from a blue-collar worker's family.

I'm pretty good at my job (broader data science) and have been earning US-level income while maintaining Eastern Europe-level expenses for the last 7 years or so. Thus, I've managed to have a decent amount of savings in cash and index funds / ETFs .

During the last recession (2007-8), I was just 16yo and my family was hit pretty hard back then. Now, I do believe that recessions are the only realistic way to achieve real social mobility, and have been planning to really benefit from the next one (whenever it happens).

Any additional thoughts, tips, and personal experiences are welcome.


  👤 satvikpendem Accepted Answer ✓
I will post again my answer to what someone else asked similarly the other day [0]:

One thing we must make clear is, is there actually a recession? Many companies are firing, but they've fired much fewer than they've hired in the past few years. Many companies are still hiring now. I don't think there is a recession, much as people might be scared that there is.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34296393


👤 eastbayjake
It's counterintuitively a great time to start a business! Lots of poorly-managed startups are going to fold, which increases talent availability and decreases competition. Having a startup that has found product-market fit and is ready for growth coming out of the recession is an interesting opportunity - there was significant discussion of this during the the initial COVID downturn (obviously in a very different interest rate environment re: seeking investor funding)

👤 granshaw
The most talked-about coming recession ever... don't go overboard, in case it doesn't happen...

👤 poulsbohemian
Having lived through like 5+ of these downturns now, here's what I tell my kids:

-- These cycles are part of the sickness of our system. Prepare for it.

-- When times are good, hoard money. IE: save it, don't spend it. Put it in the market, in assets, in something for when you need it.

-- Always have a side hustle. It doesn't have to be much, but some little side thing where you are making a little money can make a difference when times get tough if you lose your main income source.

-- Live way below your means. While I hate the idea of being so frugal that you can't enjoy life, the cycles I've seen tell me that you have to be really on top of this. Drive that used car for 5 more years. Don't go out to eat. Buy clothes only at thrift. Don't expect to be able to vacation every year. Squeeze that budget as tight as you can to make sure that you have cash in the bank to last a year+, and more than that if you have a spouse /house / kids.

-- Even when things are bad, there's someone out there who is making money and doing ok. Health care, for example, at least in the US, is often a safe place to work in bad times. There are stocks that run counter to the rest of the market, etc.

--Try to stay ahead of the curve when things look like there are clouds coming. The market can shift downward quickly and unexpectedly, but it is often a longer, slower improvement. There is no logic to any of this, it is often the whims of forces we don't control.

-- Decide how much risk you are willing to take on in life. Being a self-employed / small-business owner is hard in a downturn.

I'm optimistic that things are going to get better again throughout 2023, because the things that are dragging us down at the moment feel more ephemeral than real, IE: we're in a recession because we all think we are in a recession and we are all following the playbook for a recession. So there will be layoffs and cutbacks etc until such time as we all realize it's probably not armageddon and we all go back to trying to push our respective businesses forward again.


👤 st4lz
Plan all big improvements to your house, when the construction sector would have a hard time finding a job. Any expensive improvement like roof, road, fence should be much cheaper.

I consider the Eastern Europe having unique opportunity these days, as the Ukrainian market has extremely good potential to grow in many areas. If it goes EU+NATO direction after the war, it may boost the whole region and follow the direction set by other countries two decades ago. Just the property market alone rose manyfold in those countries after the EU access.

I am in a similar position to you, living in EE country as well. We may exchange some contact and share some more info if you are interested.


👤 poordadrichson
OP here: Thanks for the comments so far. Please, let's not sidetrack on whether there will indeed be a recession, it's a self-fulfilled prophecy etc. My point is what to do when it happens 6,12,18 months from now and/or if this happens 3 years from now. I think this should be obvious.

👤 adenozine
Realistically, if it’s as bad as they say, it could be wise to become a little bit liquid right now to reinforce your buying power during the apparently inevitable massive dip that’s coming.

Personally, I don’t see it getting nearly as bad as 2008, but I could be wrong. I think some big corps will eat shit, there will be some layoffs, yada yada same old shit. There’s not going to be thousands of people suddenly homeless and destitute like before.


👤 lallysingh
There's some valid doubt [1] on whether the recession is going to happen, or if we'll muddle through on near-zero growth for a bit. But that's beside the point.

It's a good time to read up on investing now, figure out some asset classes (real estate, securities, gold, crypto, etc) that you think you could fairly evaluate, and then be ready to buy when you see stuff priced below what they're worth.

Investing is risky, so don't put all your eggs in one basket.

[1] I read this in two places, and forgot both, sorry.


👤 Giorgi
Everyone is talking about "coming recession" but it is nowhere to be seen, it's like everyone was awaiting "Twitter collapse" because Elon is not woke enough. It never came. I don't think there will be recession soon enough to worry.

👤 Apreche
Invest in yourself. Everyone is in the same boat together. Just be the best you that you can be.

👤 DwnVoteHoneyPot
No one here has asked you about your risk tolerance. If you need to avoid losses (maybe due to supporting the family), you move to cash or partially to cash. I wouldn't have a fear of missing out if there is no recession because your income is how you make money, not betting on the market.

If you're sure a recession is coming, you move to cash or partially to cash. That allows you to buy in when things are lower (eg. Warren Buffet always carries lots of cash and everyone came begging to him in 2008 and he promptly told everyone to bend-over and he did some amazing deals).

In summary, if your risk adverse => cash. If you want to be opportunistic => cash.


👤 roland35
Cash is king. With interest rates high, if you can pay cash for anything like a car or house there may be good deals. Right now supply is tight so prices are still high, but we'll see if that continues.

👤 jedberg
In the 2002/2003 recession I shifted all my investments to REITs. That worked out pretty well, and when those topped out I shifted everything to VTI (total market index) and rode that up to the top.

But basically you want to be in investments that are easy to liquidate and will generally hold steady, so that when the bottom comes and goes and we're out of the recession you can quickly shift to growth vehicles again.


👤 1nd1ansumm3r
Success often arrives through pre-established channels. If there is something you are already good at, maybe direct your efforts there. Employ some other data scientists and a sales person and you can run the show. Or use your cash to swoop in on some down markets. Essentially stick to a workflow you are already familiar with.

👤 traceroute66
> have a decent amount of savings in cash

How much is a "decent amount" ?

If its not equivalent to 6–12 months salary, then its not enough.

Yes, the foolhardy will try to tell you that 6–12 months cash in the bank is deadwood. But they are wrong.

What happens if you lost your job tomorrow ? You're unlikely to walk straight into another job are you!

What happens if some other $expensive_shit hits the fan ? Trust me, you'll be grateful for a cash cushion.

Make sure you always have a decent cash cushion before you start looking at investing with those dangerous rose-tinted spectacles.


👤 sobkas
Best thing you can do to prepare for coming fake recession is to start hiking prices and force salaries down, so you will continue to have record breaking profits. And when real recession will finally hit, you can tell "Didn't I said so?" and use your past profits to carve even bigger part of economy for yourself.

👤 michpoch
If I read your post correctly and you still live in Eastern Europe - I'd use these funds to invest in security of you and your family and move out. Even being a few hundred kms further to the west (Romania / Slovakia / Poland) would put you in a much better situation.

👤 gnicholas
I'd be curious about unique opportunities for smaller startups that are doing well. What is 'on sale' right now that we should consider buying more of? Have advertising rates nose dived to a point where it could make sense for startups, for example?

👤 monero-xmr
Income generating assets in industries that are resilient during recessions. Oil and gas, rental property, bedrock consumer goods like toilet paper, owning a business that has cash flow you can access. Diversify.

👤 mikewarot
I suggest you acquaint yourself with the work of Peter Zeihan. There are demographic forces at play that are likely to swamp any marginal gains made trying to time the market, etc.

👤 noelbautista91
I was about the same age as you during the last recession, but in the US.

Looking back, I would strap up on cash until interest rates go down, or (the easy way) is to dollar cost average SP500.


👤 LUmBULtERA
There will always be another recession, but no one knows when. Therefore, the way you position yourself now should really be how you would position yourself at any time.

👤 TradingPlaces
1. If there is a recession in the EU, nothing like 2008. It will be much shallower and shorter.

2. It actually looks like European data is rebounding a little, so y’all may skirt it.


👤 breckenedge
Depends on how active you want to be with your investments. There are many investments that have the potential to exceed index fund returns, but they come with greater risks and time demands. Do you want to start your own business? Or invest in other assets like real estate? Basically, how willing are you to upset your lifestyle?

I think looking ahead to the next big (known) global risk is wise. From what I can see, there will be a global plateau in working populations in the early 2030s, with many countries seeing a larger percentage of older adults relying on a smaller number of working-age folks. How will that affect you and your community? You may want to prepare now for that.


👤 westonplatter0
To rephrase your question, what are the structural alpha opportunities within economic slowdowns/recessions? Check out SSRN for those.

👤 user_named
Buy China ETFs for growth, and Emerging Market dividend ETFs for cash flow. Both are super cheap after 2022.

👤 drbeast
When everyone is expecting a recession, one does not come.

Expecting higher inflation and flat to slightly reduced growth (aka stagflation). Find dividend paying stocks that actually keep up with inflation (10-20%). They exist and have track records of maintaining this pay out, you just need to find them.


👤 babypuncher
Wait wasn't the recession supposed to happen last year?