HACKER Q&A
📣 codemusings

What do you use email for?


I think it's safe to say that email as a concept is pretty much broken. You're fighting spam. There's no true privacy between correspondents, not even with PGP. It's used everywhere as an identification token. Some people still even use it to exchange files.

There's no easy fix because it's next to impossible to retain backwards compatibility. So it got me thinking: what use case would you actually carry over if you were to replace it by redesigning it from the ground up and everyone got on board in an instant?

I took a peek at my inboxes and my correspondence (if you want to call it that, because let's face it: most of it is pretty one-sided) mostly falls into three categories:

  * Newsletters I was signed up for involuntarily by signing up to a website

  * Newsletters I actually signed up for

  * Commercial correspondence (e.g. insurance, bank, landlord)
The last one surely could use some privacy that scales. But the first two? Is that really what email was intended for? In the 90s you stayed in touch with friends and family. But that's been replaced by instant messaging platforms.

I'm curious what your opinions are.


  👤 impendia Accepted Answer ✓
I am a university professor. I use email and have no desire to switch to some fancy tool. Some typical use cases:

- I collaborate on research projects with people all over the world, and I exchange emails with my collaborators. Such emails might be "Here's idea X", "Please look at my revision of our paper, I changed Y or Z", or "Can we set up a Skype meeting". (If my email refers to a file, I might attach it, although most of my collaborators and I use Dropbox.)

Typically I keep these emails in my box until I've fully dealt with them. (This might be months.)

- My students send my emails about class. I usually get to these fairly quickly.

- Sometimes I get questions or comments from random mathematicians about my work, and I try to answer these. (The reverse happens too!)

- I often get individual emails asking me to do things. Speak at a conference, review a paper, etc. These often come from people I don't know well.

- Personal and social correspondence. For example, email is how I most often talk with my mother. I'm aware that most people use instant messaging, but I like the slower pace and the lack of expectation to respond right away.

- A to-do list. Many of the above are asking me to do something, or at least to reply, and I typically keep the email in my inbox until I have done it.

It has its annoyances, but overall it seems like the right tool for the job.

To be honest, I've never understood the perspective of people who want to move away from email. For example, I've involved in a weekly D+D game, and we trade emails from time to time. One of the players suggested that we set up a Slack channel. (I don't otherwise use Slack.) This would give me one more thing to either (1) remember to check, or (2) allow to interrupt me. Why would I want this? The advantage of email is that I can handle it on my own schedule.

Finally, the privacy issue -- to be honest, I don't much care. Perhaps this is the nature of my work, which I typically want to share as widely as possible. For student interactions there are privacy laws, but my employer has presumably ensured that our email software complies with them. (And, if they haven't, it's someone else's problem.)

The sense I get is that, increasingly, people don't mind being interrupted all the time. That's not me. On the one hand I'm very curious about what you envision replacing email; but on the other, I'm afraid that you'd only wrest my email account from me over my cold, dead body.


👤 sdwedq
Between my work and gmail email accounts, I don't get much spam in my inbox. I also use filters, so newsletters, emails from various systems such as build tools, github, social media, etc, go to appropriate folders.

My inbox is my to-do list. I email myself things that I need to do too.

Unlike Slack, no one on email minds if you reply back a few days later. I like that it is async medium for communication.

Honestly, I think email is great and it would take a lot for me to give it up.


👤 Nextgrid
My email use is very different. What actually lands in my inbox is person to person communications (some of it is commercial, like from my accountant or salespeople I reached out to, but it still comes from a person). On a busy day I might get a handful of emails at best landing in the inbox so email is not a problem for me.

I make sure to unsubscribe from any newsletters as the first step after signing up for an account so I don't receive any, and automated notifications I can't opt-out of are filtered away.

The big problem you raise about "spam" (whether real spam or unwanted newsletters) are a problem with defective privacy legislation that allows companies to get away with it as opposed to problems with email itself. If marketing communications were made opt-in by law (one that's actually enforced) this will dramatically cut down on the noise in people's inboxes.

Commercial correspondence regarding an ongoing deal (like the examples you mention) seem like a good thing. I want my landlord or bank or other suppliers to be able to contact me if they want to as long as it's not marketing (which would be addressed by the previous point).

The problems with non-technical people having their inbox flooded and constantly saying at 10k+ unread emails is because they fail or can't be bothered to manage it (by setting up rules and unsubscribing whenever possible). I don't think it's a flaw of email itself.

Privacy is the only thing here I agree with, and I believe that can be solved with public keys embedded in the DNS (itself protected by DNSSEC). The problem with that is lack of mainstream client support (whether for S/MIME or GPG); the protocols email is based on don't seem like a blocker in this case.


👤 alexmingoia
I think your premise is wrong.

- People don’t fight spam. I rarely if ever get spam in my email. Spam filters work well enough. Whitelisting is also available. Most all email clients support smart folders that contain emails only from contacts.

- Email IS private. Privacy =/= E2E encryption. Other people cannot read my email. My friends and business competitors cannot read my email. Providers can, but are incentivized to not read their customers’ email, otherwise they would go out of business.

- PGP does work. Most people don’t need it.


👤 easytiger
you cant replace email.

its a way that allows unrelated systems to talk using a protocol.

today it would be a monolithic one company app.

that's not email.